Finnish ...And Oceans has always been a slight different band in the black metal scene. Be it because of the lyrics, the song titles or the album covers which made the band always a little bit more remarkable than many other bands. Now they recently released their new album "The Regeneration Itinerary" (read review here) which is much different from its previous albums. More dark, more aggressive, more disturbing. Reason enough to ask for the whys and hows - and my questions were answered via Zoom by Timo (git.), Pyri (bass) and Mathias (voc.). Enjoy reading

Michael

Hey, how are you doing?

All: Fine, very good, thank you!!

How dark and annoying was the time when you wrote and recorded your new album? It is full of anger and very dark….

M: Yeah, it actually turned out a little bit more extreme in some aspects. When we were in the studio, for example the sounds, when we did the guitars, we wanted to have them a little bit more aggressive because of the riffs that we have on this album. That also sort of contributed to the order of it and the tempo is higher in some songs because of the drums.

P: I think that we just wanted to do something else than we did on the previous two comeback albums. So this might be the case why it is a bit more dark and aggressive.

T: It was semi-intentional to do something a bit different but of course maintaining the basic sound of the basic sound of …And Oceans, try something different for once.

What I personally think is that these sorts of techno-samples are very disturbing and give your music a more futuristic touch than before. You don't want to make it too easy for the listener, am I right with that? When I drove to school and listened for it the first time, I just thought "what the fuck is that?".

P: That's the perfect expression now we have succeeded because we wanted to do something completely different this time.

T: Especially that "what the fuck"! Maybe not intentionally making it not easy but the "what the fuck" was at least one thing that we were trying to do. A few of those songs I think are in the same vein as on the previous albums. At least my songs are a bit the same way, maybe they have some different riffs but especially Anttis' songs are different from the last album with those techno elements.

M: I remember when we started writing the album, we sort of talked about how we allow ourselves to be a little bit more experimental on this album and to see what happens. We didn't know where it was gonna go. Of course at that point we decided to not choose the basic keyboard sound and not to do the classic black metal riffs, giving us the freedom to experiment a little bit more on this album.

T: For me at least at some point it felt like are these songs really going to work? But when we heard the final results we were really happy with those and that we kept on going to make those different tracks.

…and in "The Form And The Formless" you have this kind of Lola Runs sample. Did you have the movie in mind when you composed that song?

T: (Laughs) This is something our keyboard player has done. Somebody says that it has something to do with Nintendo, haha.

Not only the music but also both, the album and the song titles are quite challenging. What the hell is the regeneration itinerary?

M: (Laughs) How to say? It's a guide book. The whole album is a journey. It's a road with good and bad experiences on the way. This album sort of serves as a guide book for life or for the human that you have become today; be a good or a bad person. The album sort of explains the journey and hopefully you can learn something on the way. In a way it's all about enlightenment, it's a little bit like a diary.

Most of the titles sound quite gloomy and devastating like "The Fire In Which We Burn", "The Ways Of Sulphur" or "Towards The Absence Of Light". What is the main topic on the album?

M: There are not all good experiences on the way like it is the case in life. There are some really dark moments in there. The album before – "As In Garden So In Tombs" – had a kind of positive vibe in the end of the lyrics. It is more like discovering the pathways to different kinds of road to an end but here there's some really dark stuff going on.

Did you use some personal experiences for the lyrics or was it more abstract stuff you're writing about?

M: I never really wanted to write something that is really personal in a way but it just happened. That was what came out of my pen this time. Last year was a really hard year for a lot of people and that's probably why it sort of turned out in this kind of gloomy way.

The titles have become more and more cryptic on the last albums. What do you think when you look back to older songs like "I Wish I Was Pregnant" or "Intelligence Is Sexy"?

M: I should ask Kenny some time because he actually has written them for these songs (laughs). What was the idea? He never really told anything about the lyrics either. I've read a lot of interviews he did back that day and he always has been really cryptic about the lyrics.

T: I think he took the inspiration from those bands that do industrial and ambient. I remember they had those really weird lyrics and track names. Maybe one inspiration is coming from there.

So you don't feel a little bit ashamed because these little bit more foolish song titles when the band was in its infancy but you're all fine with them?

P: Definitely. I got very interested in the band back in the day mainly because of the titles. All the other symphonic black metal bands were singing about these so-called "normal" subjects in that genre and then …And Oceans had songs like "I Wish I Was Pregnant". I was like "what is this" and their music is really symphonic black metal and that really got me interested in the whole thing. I am super proud to be a part of that nowadays because it's something else than the other bands are doing.

T: For me, back in the 90s when we had those first tours and gigs, maybe I was a bit, well not really ashamed but when I think now it was that era of …And Oceans that we are proud of now with what we did and we are not ashamed at all of that era.

Is intelligence still sexy in 2025 or is it quite old-fashioned these days when you look at the world today?

T: Haha, maybe.

P: It would need a lot more intelligence nowadays when you for example look at this kind of clown show.

Apropos intelligence – what do you think about AI in music / arts?

M: Oh well, that's a hard question. It's some kind of double edged sword. The whole AI thing is so much in its infancy still that we haven't learned how to use it properly. At some point you can start integrating it into music. Not writing 100% with AI and doing all the covers but I think at some point it can actually turn into an available tool to for example get new ideas. But I think it's still way too early to be the judge of what it's gonna be like.

The cover of "The Regeneration Itinerary" and its predecessor "As In Gardens, So In Tombs" look very beautiful but also a little bit artificial – did you have some help from a non-human friend?

M: Not really. Adrian just spends a lot of time doing these things. It's incredible the amount of work he puts into it. So there's no AI used on the albums.

What's the meaning behind this cover?

M: With all the covers Adrian has done for us, we send him lyrics first and the album title. Then he starts implementing those elements from the lyrics into it and sort of interpreting what's going on in a very artistic and avantgardish way. But still it's really cool because you can see the things from the lyrics, you can see in those details a lot of things we're singing about coming to life. On this album everything goes really hand in hand, the music, the lyrics and the cover, everything. It's all in the same concept and really describing.

In contrast to that, the cover of "A.M.G.O.D." and "Cypher" aren't the best and it is hard to get the albums, digitally they even aren't available on your Bandcamp site. Do you plan any re-releases and digital downloads for them?

T: They should be available as digital downloads now. I think Century Media put them online a few months ago. They have this price cutter series or something like that where you get them for about six Euros.

I wanted to see you this March in Oberhausen together with Ancient Rites and many more – unfortunately Heretic March was cancelled. What are the upcoming tour plans?

M: There are plans about it. We have a few album release shows in Finland and Finnish festivals, also PartySan in August and a lot of plans for the end of the year.

The final words belong to you!

M: Well, the classic answer (laughs). Keep your eyes open, there's a lot of new music coming and there are also a lot of shows coming up. Hope to see you out on the road somewhere this year!

P: The new album is coming out in May with some singles coming out so go check this out!

Hate always keeps you on the edge of the seat. Their albums change. Their image changes. They bring fresh energy and push boundaries of what can be done in extreme metal. Not everybody likes Hate but everybody should know Hate. Their music and passion inspires. Their message is clear. They're doing their thing and getting stronger with every step. I had a chance to talk to ATF Sinner last year over couple beers and then some. It took awhile to get the answers back but with the amount of touring they did last year who can blame him. Hate or be hated!

Tom (Pictures by Monika)


Thank you so much for finding time to do this. How is life on tour treating you?

Usually, it treats us well, but sometimes you may face unexpected situation and you have to find a way out pretty quickly. For example, a few days ago a sound guy whom we hired on this tour simply disappeared without a word! Later I learnt that he didn't feel safe in our RV! (laughs). Fortunately we found a replacement immediately and we sound even better now!

Look, touring is generally hard work and a lot of fun from time to time too. If you deliver good shows, you can draw lots of satisfaction from it. Also touring is a very important part of our activity. It gives us a lot of experiences that you cannot get elsewhere. It also makes you more conscious of what you do and how you do it. It gives you a different perspective on your music too, because you can see how people react and how they understand your message.

Tour bus must have been a danger zone (hahaha) I know it can be, I've visited. What was the most memorable show so far? Was touring with Rotting Christ a lot of fun, or did you guys hang out more with Melechesh? How do those 2 compare?

The shows in California and in some Canadian cities were most memorable because we have lots of fans there who had previously seen us on tour with Hypocrisy. So we got enthusiastic reactions from them, which was great. When it comes to the bands we're touring with, both Melechesh and Rotting Christ are cool people and we really get along with them. Melechesh are musically closer to what we do, but I like both bands. Rotting Christ are really effective on stage. Both bands have some "ethnical" elements in their music and use mythologies in their lyrics.

Hate's tour spread out over 3 months or so. What is the first thing you're going to do when you get back home?

I'll definitely take some days off and try to relax. I miss watching TV and especially news in Polish.


In my opinion "Erebos" is slightly different than the previous two albums; it is slower, heavier and not as much industrialized as let's say, "Anaclasis". Would you change anything if you had a chance or was everything about it totally premeditated?

"Erebos" is a natural consequence of our previous works, and seems to be a highlight in our discography... beyond doubt, the darkest and best produced album we've done thus far. We wanted to record an album that would not be easily classified; extreme, but innovative at the same time. We also wanted to broaden our perspective and enrich the music with some new elements. Still the core or our style is Death/Black Metal, but on "Erebos" you can hear distinct influences from Heavy Metal, Death Core, some Groovy stuff here and there, and also some Industrial and Ambient sounds, but not too much. I think it's quite a diverse album for extreme metal. I wanted to go further with experiments, but, honestly, we hadn't enough time in the studio to realize all ideas that came to our heads. I think out style won't stay the same on the next albums, because all we want is to change, explore new areas...

I've listened to the album many times and it became my favorite almost instantly. How much of the creating part of the new music comes from you and do you work with other members of Hate? How do you handle the changes in line-up? Do you utilize any of the available internet resources (i.e. Skype) to work remotely?

I usually come up with main ideas and work on them with a drummer. It's a time consuming process because we arrange the drums and guitars with all small details. When we have the music arranged I then start working on lyrics and together with Destroyer we do solos and guitar leads. On this stage we record some ideas at home and send to each other back and forth until we find forms that match the main arrangement best.

With all the touring you did last year and all this time on the road let me ask you this: Erebos came out in 2010. Did you write anything new lyrics or music-wise?

Oh yes, I'm always working on some new stuff, it's like a never ending process. Something you can't really stop doing. We have two new tracks completed and at least 4 in the making. It all sounds very promising to my ear. I think we'll enter the studio in June next year and the album should be ready for autumn release on Napalm Records. I also have some fragments of lyrics written. They refer to classical Greek tragedies that bring very universal messages that may still appeal to contemporary people.

What comes first when you create new material, how do you prepare the lyrics and what inspires the music?

It usually starts with a combination of riffs and main ideas of lyrics. I want to have some topic first to know what it is going to be about. I get inspired in this way and it's easier to compose.


I've read most of the lyrics from all of the albums and I'm immensely impressed. They're written with a lot of wit and leave room for interpretation. How do you put yourself in the right state of mind to write and what would you recommend to someone that wanted to find out more about what is behind the lyrics?

I like my lyrics to be poems that have philosophical elements. They often deal with things that lie beyond comprehension and can be interpreted in different ways. So it's up to a listener how he wants to understand them. Some deal with universal things like fear, pain, afterlife (if it exists?), madness, death, deceit, false image. I often use occult or satanic philosophies because they are close to my personal beliefs.

Can you tell us a little bit about the creation of "Erebos"?

As we toured a lot after releasing "Morphosis", most of the new songs were written between tours or just on the road.. For example, the song "Transsubstance" was written on the US tour, just a few weeks before we entered the studio. As for the recording, it took us almost t 5 weeks. The sessions took place in two studios in Poland: Hertz and Efektura. All went pretty smooth because we knew exactly what we wanted to achieve, so there was not so much experimenting with the sound etc. Earlier we had recorded a detailed demo with most of the songs, so it was clear how it would all sound. We actually entered the studio 2 days after our arrival from North American tour with Hypocrisy, so we all were suffering from time change etc. It took us a few days to adapt well to the studio, hang out a little with Wieslawski Bros (with whom we've been friends for years) and to concentrate on recording. But once we started the proper session, it just went smooth. We just wanted to use all the potential of the studio and I'm sure we succeeded in doing this.

Nowadays, it's easy to find out about opinions about your album. Most of it even before the album comes out. Do you read all that or do you completely ignore all that and do your own thing?

I read them to understand how people see my music. However, every review of an album is nothing but one person's impression. And you cannot please everyone. Anyway, it's always interesting to see how people perceive our works and what their impressions are.

Hate's previous albums premiered on vinyl last fall. Are you a collector, what do you think about vinyl releases?

I do not collect vinyls. I just have a few - mostly gifts I've been given. However, I agree that vinyl has something magical that cd lacks. They say it conveys more low frequencies than a cd, those frequencies that you can't really hear by ear but they certainly effect your body in some way. Besides, some vinyl releases are real pearls for collectors.

What is your favorite artist, what kind of music do you listen to to relax and unwind? Is there anything new in your collection?

I listen to a big range of music, so it's hard to point at one favourite artist or band. I'll name a few just to give you impression of what I like. Nine Inch Nails, Tool, Tori Amos, Diamanda Galas, Fields of The Nephilim, Anaal Nathrakh, Mayhem, Pantera, Johnny Cash, Slayer, Immortal, The Cult, AC/DC, Dead Can Dance, Chopin, Beethoven, Penderecki, Shostakovich, Bartok etc. I rarely listen to music for relaxation, because I find myself too involved in it. Listening to music I can't concentrate on anything elese. I rather watch TV for relaxation. I love cinema!

Labels come and go; they are not created equal. How was Listenable Records treating Hate? Do you think they promoted you guys enough?

Listenable is a good label when it comes to Europe. In America they have poor distribution and they don't support our efforts enough. So, after releasing "Erebos", we decided to change the label. We talked to some, and finally we decided on Napalm Records to be our publisher for future albums. We will start working with them for real when the new album is ready. I wish for better collaboration and much better promotion of our stuff in the future.

I know that recently some of the band members got endorsed with companies that, well, create your "tools." Are there any favorites, any brands of musical equipment that you may favor over the others?

We work closely with Fernandez Guitars and Run Guitars. Both companies produce amazing instruments. I use Run "Invader" model which was created to my likes, and soon I'll get a new model called "Thor". Destroyer plays on Fernandez "Vortex". We both use Bash Amps, which work great on stage as well as in studio. Our drummer works closely with Czarcie Kopyto. It's a Polish manufacture that makes drum pedals of highest quality.

Do you play any other instruments yourself?

Well, you have programs these days that enable you to achieve any sound you like. So you don't need to play, for example trumpet or horn to record music composed on those instruments. All you need is a keyboard, good computer and special software. So what really counts is an overall knowledge about music that you have as well as your musical tastes. However, it's good to know how to play an instrument, especially if you compose on it. Besides guitar I can play bass, drums, and piano.

For anyone that would like to buy you a drink at a concert - what is your poison of choice?

I love Mad Dogs - vodka mixed with cherry juice and Tobasco.

What is the biggest lie you ever told?

I don't remember.

Do you believe in the end of the world in 2012?

Nope. I think that prophecies of any kind are bullshit.

What can you never get enough of?

There's no such thing. Too much of anything leads to overdose. In order to take pleasure in something you need to take breaks from it. Otherweise, you end up being fed up.

Dude. It was awesome talking to you, and I really appreciate the time you've put into this, knowing how busy you guys are. I hope to catch up with you again after the new album comes out (which I'm looking forward to very much!).

Great thanks for this interview. It's always a pleasure to meet you guys! and to your readers: Rest in fuckin HATE! We'll be back in America sometimes soon!